Is an operating agreement for an LLC even necessary? So far I haven't really seen the need for one. Are there any special instances in which one is required?

... NM does not require an operating agreement and so I never use one for holding title to a vehicle or real estate.

However, if you work with other members in a business enterprise, then you do need one.

I met the seller at a DMV license plate office one afternoon. He had to show his drivers license, but I didn't. I gave the name of the LLC and an Alaska address, and showed my insurance binder in the LLC's name. They didn't even ask to see any proof of the LLC's existence.

This was in early 2008; perhaps policy has changed since then? I wonder if the other reader's problem was having a business address in NC? Perhaps my LLC's out-of-state business address kept them from asking for my NC drivers license. That's the only difference in our experiences that I can see. I did have an unpleasant experience when a cop grilled me about why my LLC was incorporated in New Mexico and had its address in Alaska ... I think if the address had been somewhere less unconventional, like NYC or Boston or something, he wouldn't have been as curious. J.J., have you or any other readers ever had a tough time explaining to a cop why the LLC was formed in New Mexico but its business address is somewhere far away?

... No, Dave, the question has never been asked. Normally, the cop is interested only in YOU (unless the car has been reported stolen). If I ever AM asked, I will say, correctly, that NM was chosen because it has a low initial fee and no annual reports. (I'd not mention the privacy angle.) This is similar to big corporations that incorporate in Delaware because of the corporate laws on the books.

Apparently you purchased from a private party, and that makes all the difference I think. It was probably the dealer that was giving him trouble. I encouraged him to turn the car back to the dealer but I think he wanted to keep it, regardless.

If there is no way around it and you must register the LLC with Montana (seems unlikely), you might be able to have the Montanta-registered LLC owned by another NM LLC in order to maintain your privacy. This "nested" LLC concept is similar to how an LLC can be a resident agent for another LLC to maintain the privacy of the registered agent.

Good luck. Keep us posted!

---------------

I decided to test the Post Office's verification of "home" address when opening a PO box. I filled out the form, used a passport for ID, and gave a commercial address that looks like a residential address. I was told that a letter would be sent to me and that I could bring the letter back to complete the opening of the box. The letter never showed up. I tried the exact same thing at another post office and got the same result - no letter.

Looks like they do verify addresses...

"The last two times I've registered vehicles in the name of an LLC (in Georgia and Florida) it was as simple as handing over my title and a couple bucks "

... Stan,
I doubt that any elaboration is needed. I've had the same experience as Ben, every time. I just hand over the title (already filled out), pay the fee, and leave. Period.

A better thing to do is open a PMB in a neighboring town for the parent and teenager to share. If the teenager moves out their sole address should be the PMB mailing address or a ghost address as an alternate choice.

Is this teenager going to attend college? Start now! High School Students should get a ghost address in their town and when they turn 18 change over any bank accounts to that address immediately. High School students would benefit from a real ghost address in their own town before sending off college applications with a money order payment.

If a student uses a ghost address even 1 town away there may be a red flag for College Admissions as to why the town does not match the location of the high school. Once this student sends in his applications for colleges, is accepted, and then moves to the college town, setting up a CMRA should be a first thing upon arrival in town or even in advance. Any credit card marketing/promotions/credit reporting agencies selling data would go to the young adult's Ghost address or CMRA. For any ghosters whose family will be attending college in late August perhaps you want to suggest setting up a CMRA the 1st day of arrival, or else even months before as soon as a letter of acceptance is received.

The other plus is that any roommates after living in a dorm situation won't have access to the young adult's mail in an apartment situation with a shared apartment mailbox. The other benefit is year-round mail can continue even if the student is out of town for 3 months in the summer. The same address can be kept at the CMRA in the college town for a few years and would be semi-convienent near local stores. Perhaps mail forwarding can be setup for summer months or winter vacation?

I'm very interested in learning how to go about taking advantage of Montana's "loose" registration requirements. I recently purchased a vehicle for cash and went to the DMV in my county to register the vehicle in the name of my LLC. The kind lady behind the counter happens to be a neighbor of mine so I figured I was a shoe-in for my registration.

I explained to her what I wanted to do and immediately she cut me off and explained that I needed to have my LLC registered with the state first. She then went on to explain that once I did that they would check to make sure I had in fact registered with the state. They would also have to verify any addresses I presented them. Once this was completed I could pay the $398 registration fee -hardly low by comparison to any other state. For all intents and purposes I found myself being shot down at every turn!

The last two times I've registered vehicles in the name of an LLC (in Georgia and Florida) it was as simple as handing over my title and a couple bucks (try about $25 instead of Montana's $398!) Any ideas how I could still register in Montana without any hassles?

I'm more than willing to go to a different county and try again if need be. If there's no hope for Montana, does anyone have any experience titling in North Dakota or Wyoming? Thanks a ton in advance for any pointers or advice.

If it's a "company car" and it's registered to a NM company, then why not put NM plates on it and tell NC to stuff it?

You've got the car, you've got temporary plates, if you paid the car in cash, demand the dealer hand over the title and tell him to take a hike too.

You might look into Montana too. They have very loose registration laws and VERY low ownership fees and NO sales tax. Colorado HATES Montana because RV buyers go to Montana, buy a half-million dollar RV up there, title it to an LLC with a resident agent address in Montana, and bring it back to Colorado on Montana plates without paying either sales taxes or the onerous Colorado registration fees.

This came out in a story on the TV news a year or two ago, and they had tape of the director of the Department of Revenue carping about how "illegal" it is for Colorado residents to use vehicles titled in Montana here in Colorado, and that they weren't paying their "fair share" of the necessary taxes to keep the roads in repair, and that the state was "looking into" such abuses and was "talking to" Montana officials...who were telling them to get stuffed.

The bottom line is that if you have a "business" in Montana, your home state isn't going to be able to do much of anything about your vehicle registration in the state where your vehicle is titled because of the Full Faith and Credit provisions of the Constitution.

For them to do anything, they have to prove that you don't actually have a business in Montana (and if you have a Montana LLC, you definitely have a business there) and that you have the intent to evade NC licensing and regisration laws and taxes.

Your argument is that you have a business in Montana, that it's none of their business what you do in Montana (make it an on-line business selling cat food or something with a web page that has orders sent by mail to your Montana ghost address and then forwarded to you if you're really paranoid about it, or do what I do, which is become a journalist and have your ISP in Montana) and you have every right to register your company vehicle in Montana and use it for whatever you like, wherever you happen to be.

The amount of time and money they would have to spend to track you down and prove that you're not arguably legit far exceeds the benefit of getting your registration money, so they most likely won't bother.

In another recent case, a trucking company that operates here in Colorado, that operates more than a hundred big trucks, has all its vehicles registered in Montana, to a desk with a chair and a FAX machine in the truck dealership in Montana where they buy their equipment. The news made a big stink about it, but the company has been doing it for more than 20 years and says flatly that it has the right to register its trucks wherever it likes, which is true, and that they save more than half a million dollars EACH YEAR in registration fees by doing so.

Last I heard, nothing had been done to the company and they were continuing on as before. It's unlikely NC is going to even figure it out, especially if your daughter, a college student, is driving the company car. Just prepare her with the cover story and have her refer any inquiries to you.

A NCDL is required here for ID & they made a copy. They do at the DMV here also. I know this as my company bought a privately owned trailer within the last 2 months & it was done at the DMV also.

I used a PO Box & a company street address in NC as to not set off and alarms. The street did not match my DL. Paid with bank check. Had to complete a FACR form I think that is what it was called. Offshore drug dealer money laundering form. This was for a used car around $10K. but the deal went a OK left with car and a 30 day tag yesterday. Today by 8:00 AM I delivered car to my daughter 2 hour drive away.

Around 11:00 Am the day after I got the car with my daughter having the keys in her hand the dealer called & left a message that NC requires:

a. Articles of inc. filed with Sec. of State 1st page of charter with title. I do not want to foreign file with NC Sec. of State as this may trigger just that w/ the use of a NM LLC.

b. Evidence of an assumed name filed w/ Reg. of deeds in the county.

c. Privilege license in city or county. This may work at additional cost and may cause NC LLC foreign file trigger & tax problems later.

d. Use of name issued by the Federal motor carrier safety adm. N/A to me.

c. Fed ID doc. I'm thinking EIN # copy N/A to me.

Dealer was only told the LLC Name and not state. This may not work out. Any ideas? Thanks in advance.

Submitted Link #1: http://www.ncdot.org/dmv/vehicle_services/registra...

... Any NC drivers out there who've titled a car in that state?

I suspect it is the dealer who is causing the problem. If so, the only solution is to buy from a private party. (A friend in WA tried to buy a nearly-new car for cash yesterday, using an LLC. The dealer refused to sell unless my friend would show personal photo ID, so no sale was made. That problem never arises when you buy from a private party, assuming the seller has a clear title.)

As for the link below, it appears to appy to personal registrations. I see no mention of vehicles purchased by an out-of-state company.

UPDATE 9-19. John will return his LLC and Rosie will refund his money. A note will be made to warn any other NC residents about the state's restrictions.

JJ, thanks for your response to #6411. You're right, I do worry too much. That sounds so much nicer than saying I'm paranoid :)